Still i’m curious about numbers. Is there any sign that removal of clone upgrades increased PvP activity? I would accept even anecdotal evidences.
Yes, it is simple and very understandable. What i’m interested in are real results of this change.
Just to be clear: there were people who said “PvP-averse players will always find a reason to not do PvP”. Were they right?
CCP reported some measurable uptake at the time. I can’t provide quotes as that was old forums and a laptop ago.
Having been around at the time of the change. I can tell you without a doubt that it led to an increase in PvP.
It’s true, PvP averse players are always going to be PvP averse. But prior to the changes, even people who would otherwise throw themselves into it where much more cautious.
Newer players especially where even more cautious Since the cost of clone upgrades, and the price of forgetting was just one more barrier to entry.
NPSI or “just for fun we aint coming back alive” fleets where rare.
It also pushed older players into bigger and more expensive ships. Since the cost of clone upgrades could stack up quickly. Why fly a frigate when your clone alone costs as much as a cruiser every time you pop? (Yes you have elite pvpers using stupid expensive implants in frigates. But those give an actual edge in combat)
This is another reason why suicide ganking has run rampant. Clone cost, risk of skill point loss as well as ship cost were all deterrents. Now all there is is ship cost…which considering gankers have stacks of ships ready to go…I say bring it back.
there’s no evidence for your claim. last time we saw statistics, months ago, it was clear th<t there is less suicide ganking happening than ever. Please don’t spread nonsense you can not back up, otherwise this so called rampant suicide ganking might concentrate on people who spread ■■■■■■■■.
Like yourself.
Back up your claim, or stop spreading hate and lies.
Ok. I heard it increased PvP activity by over 9000.
So I need to prove it? To who? You? a ganker who will will not listen no matter what proof I post? Not gonna waste my time. I have already spoken to CCP with my wallet. And, Judging by the ever dwindling player base I’d say a lot of others have too.
yes you need, otherwise it is just lies.
And, to the same people you are writing that post for, and even better, to yourself, so you stop confusing “what I like to think” with “what is true”.
You know, the basis of a discussion. When you say ■■■■, the people you are talking to tell you what it is.
And, whoever is the person you are talking to, your arguments should always be the same. I never suicide ganked someone in HS yet I feel insulted by your discourse.
So your saying suicide ganking combined with ship cost and risk of skill point loss wasn’t a deterrent to ganking back then? Prove it or it’s all lies. You want proof ganking has run rampant… that’s easy. Just go back and read the forums for the last year. Every other topic is related to ganking.
no, I am not saying anything besides “if you don’t have evidence then your affirmation is false”.
eg. you affirmed that ganking has increased, without any evidence this affirmation is false.
The forum activity are not a proof of anything. For a lot of reasons, especially there is no count of the ganks on those forums.
I said what I came here to say. Like I said, I spoke to CCP with my wallet. Aside from that, I don’t have to prove anything to anyone and I don’t care if you believe it or not. Feel free to prove I was wrong though. Make sure there is “evidence”!
What a stupid, weak troll full of bitterness and hate you are.
Any yet I managed to say what I wanted without insults…who’s bitter?
US American logic. 
You’re a passive aggressive loser. vOv
Bye! 
here it is :
You have no proof of what you affirm, so your affirmation is false. Bye.
No…
Go away…
And every suicide ganking attemp should be fined with 100 million ISK on every char the player has…
You are assuming I care about proving what I said…You are mistaken. You guys are the ones throwing insults, calling me bitter and insulting what you think is my home country…I obviously struck a nerve.
If you did not care you would not post here.
Who are you trying to fool ? yourself ?
Indeed it can be avoided…by taking less risks. Is that what you want? Less risk taking? There is a name for that it is called risk aversion. Which is usually a derogatory term on these forums. “Oh you are risk averse” (usually said by an ignoramus who does not understand risk).
Yes…as Nevyn points out this is called risk aversion. I’m not saying no, I am just pointing out that you are advocating for a behavior that most people on this forum sneer at.
Presumably there is a “not” in there, as in “The goal hre is not to prevent anyone from getting into a capital…”
Again, that issue with getting back into said capital will make players less eager to get into that capital and drop it.
Yes…and people refraining from using them will mean they’ll be more risk averse. You’ll kill less of them and you’ll still have them sitting around and only being used when one side is double damn sure they can win and lose very few.
i could see this causing a spike in ganking on every ship they could gank just to screw with your skills.