This losing SP seems a dumb measure. It will put a huge damper on PVP activity. If you have an op with cheap cruisers/frigates, you might burn through few ships in a single day. If the op happens in null, they are likely paired with pod losses too. Losing SP? Heck, I wouldn’t even want to lose the first ship for the risk I might lose a pod too. Furthermore, seeing this implemented would look like “hey, buy more injectors to get in action”.
I would rather see 100% insurance in hisec, 50% in lowsec, 0% insurance in null/wh. This also makes losses more costly, and especially cap ships would get significantly more expensive to lose - most subcaps are T2 or faction variant, which have poor insurance payouts anyway.
If you want some sort of penalty for a pod loss too, rather make it “death fatigue” as suggested by someone here already. I would temporarily decrease spaceship command by 2 for each pod death starting from the max trained, including advanced spaceship command, but maybe limited to 3 on the lowend? You quickly lose ability to fly big bad ships, but you can keep jumping in action in a cheap T1 frigate.
Well we did have this function in earlier versions of EVE and it was a rather dumb affair imo, especially since it basically outright punished older players by having a “veteran tax” on buying new clones all the time and in lenght could add up.
Possibly this was a “isk sink” mechanic rather than a risk mechanic on CCPs side.
We do have the Tech3 cruiser losing skills on destruction, but the difference here is that the skills lost is also extremly easy to retrain, forexample the level 5 of a sub system can take between 3 to 5 days to train depending on your implants and attributes and is easily injected with a single injector pre-80m sp.
If SP loss is going to be a factor again then the training time of skills should also be lowered to compensate, but the concept on its own is a bit of a miss in my opinion as losing progress on your skills is grounds for a lot of people to just outright leave. Losing assets is a thing, but losing progress is just a big no-no in my fair opinion.
It is just a big carebear whine, calling for CCP to reduce PvP by adding a negative incentive. Removing the clone renewal ISK penalty and adding the insta-clone-jump in citadels are two of the most PvP-positive, fun increasing changes CCP has made to EVE.
It more appears a stealth ‘Big groups win’ thread disguised as a carebear whine actually. Because real carebears wouldn’t want to risk losing their SP this way. So it seems more a way for the big groups to ensure they can keep everyone else down.
I play EVE since 2007 and my alt had so much SP before they removed it, that no matter what subcap I would have used I would have payed more for the clone than for the ship loss. It seriously discurraged me to use that character and I made alts to have some fun in frigates without getting to pay 50x the frigate cost every time I lose a clone in a bubble.
It basically made high SP chars expensive to play. It’s not really a good mechanic to punish your players for loyality, so in a way I’m super glad they removed it as now it depends no longer on the character how much you want to risk and I have no reason to not play my main.
It actually worked like that for a reason. Look now how much titans people have and how they use them. EVE is now easy mode for caps, unbalanced, without serious consequences, no HTFU where it should be.
All the changes were made to speed up people towards this kind of end game gameplay,
removed clone cost
caps application of damage
rorquals
injectors
but there is nothing beyond it, beside TiDi and blue donut. CCP speed up game, it achieved turbo speed and it was exploited to full extend by one particular most organized group very fast. Ending in “Goonull 2019”.
CCP devs jumping ship left and right, massive layoffs, but of course:
Is nothing to do with clone costs.
If anything removing clone costs actually reduced it.
If your clone costs 250 Million each time it dies, (before implants) you are going to put it in the biggest, tankiest ship you can pretty much. You aren’t going to put it into a frigate. If it costs 0, you might go out in a frigate with a clone with no implants and have some fun.
So all those vets out there were basically forced into capitals at the time. And now they have the choice.
Also ‘massive layoffs’ equates to 3 people laid off from the EVE team, unless you have evidence of more positions being removed. The rest were related to other games.
And CCP Devs are also not jumping ship.
Stop with the mushrooms.
It do, together with other changes. Capital clones had a lot of skills, so were expensive to lose. So people were less inclined to use them. Its psychological. When something is expensive, you dont use it escept when you really must. That moment is hard to predict, so you have to stay in subcaps till you really, really have to use cap. Not every day caps everywhere, doing everything in null. And sub caps will never catch to them. Its like a wall you could now start to hit with your head and you wil end up with broken neck.
The game is now unbalanced. The balance that was there initially was throwed in the trash.
Yes they are. CCP Seagull, CCP Pointybits, there are experienced people leaving. Now the graphics guy is in charge, replacing CCP Seagull. Investors got rid of CCP for 250M $ to korean company known for making P2W game.
You are living in matrix. Its not mushroom, its the red pill or blue pill.
So a Dev leaving to focus on family after what, 5 years or more with CCP is jumping ship? That’s natural industry turnover.
And no, Cap clones had a lot of skills so they never got used to fly subcaps that they could also fly.
You can make a pure cap clone with about 50 mil sp, a cross trained subcap clone is well over 100 mil SP.
Other changes and natural accumulation of wealth are to do with capitals online. Not the removal of clone costs.
Just another instance of Malcanis law: “Whenever a mechanics change is proposed on behalf of ‘new players’, that change is always to the overwhelming advantage of richer, older players.”
For an established player it would be trivially easy to train up one of their research or cyno alts to a dedicated frigate or cruiser pilot for the cheap PvP option; they might even use an alpha account for the lolz-frigate roams. For the guy with only one account is means eating the clone costs, or not training beyond the cheap ships.
That is so new guys wil buy PLEX and then injectors. All things are interconnected. Clone changes together with other changes are basically there for people to use caps more.
Many years ago we had people talking about “EvE is dead because CCP -Codename- left”. One person posted list of CCP developers he considered important for the game. The list consisted of 10-some names. It would be good to find it in archives. I can’t find nothing in these internetz!
The only thing i remember is that list was already half-done years ago…
But hey! It’s no reason to panic because we have another reason: particular developers do not matter to success of the game! Because CCP developes it as a team!
Actually CCP is only half of employees of what it was in times when they worked on WoD. If someone thinks it doesnt affect EVE, while they are working on few games at the same time with their budget, EVE Nova being now in finishing state I think, I wonder if we will see even more people being fired because they will not be needed anymore after year or something like that after Nova launches. Like it was before.
As a low sec pilot, I love the fact SP is not lost on a pod kill. I take way more risks now, going into a fight as the underdog than I ever did before the change. Also, now you can easily be podded back home, reship and get back into the fight much faster, without worrying about losing SP for another pod loss.
I always found SP loss for a pod kill a dumb idea and am very happy CCP made the change to the way it is now. I don’t understand how the current system could possibly make a pilot more risk adverse.
Meanwhile people still lose SP while flying and losing tech 3 cruisers. So it can be done, only differently.
I wonder if CCP will ever do that for caps. I think NO, they will not. Because capitals must stay OP, with millions of HP, with thousands of manhours put into the game to keep login numbers up, untill it all becomes so boring because there is nobody to fight in them, then they will start using claws again only to fight someone, have a bit of fun…
