Off-Topic Thread vol. 2


Perhaps I just like sticking my nose into ancient archaeology because publicly available data has seemed to drop off over the last few years. One can only imagine the possibilities of what we -could- know, had the Arek’Jaalan project not been abandoned so abruptly.

So many questions left unanswered. So many technologies that fell into the shadows for unknown reasons. But I digress.

Even if you take what little -is- known out of the equation entirely, the statement still remains a steadfast constant concept throughout what history we -are- aware of.

Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

While those who do, are doubly-doomed to suffering watching in impotent frustration as the majority of humanity learns nothing, and so even those Frustrated Wise People get to experience history repeating the same themes, again and again.

This is why I’m a cynic. :wink: It means there are basically two options: Either things go better than expected… or at least I can say ‘I told you so’.

Not really.

At least not typically. Standard procedure involves the euthanization of the previous instance upon jump, followed by the careful excision of all cerebral implants by surgical machines.

You can read some more about it here.

So-called “jump cloning” works in much the same manner. Once a jump contract has been agreed upon, the customer can enter any cloning facility at any station, whereupon they will be brain-scanned, their originating bodies effectively flatlined, and their consciousness transferred to a waiting jump clone at their requested destination. Any implants in the originating body are carefully picked out by machines and just as carefully inserted into a fresh clone waiting at the original jumping-off point. Once the owner finally jumps back, from their point of view, they are returning to the same body, with the same implants and all, when in actuality it is a new clone.

While certain steps can be taken in order to, in some capacity, maintain and reuse the previous body, that is far from the industry standard.


Cynicism’s just dangling romanticism, hung by its heels. Flipping the color palette on the stars in my eyes won’t make me see clearly.

Indeed it is, but I’ve found that if you want to see clearly, the first step is acknowledging the tint in your lenses, else you can’t correct for it. Those who claim objectivity… never achieve it.

Certainly. But the flip side of that is that just acknowledging the tint is, as you say, the first step.

I have inclinations towards romanticism. It’s sneaky, so I have to watch carefully if I want to catch and correct for it. But I don’t describe myself as a romantic because it’s something I don’t want to be, and try very hard not to.

See, to me, that’s denial. I’m a cynic. By acknowledging that, I can work to look past it… but I won’t always be successful, and when I’m not it’s important that I’ve given others the tools to recognize what biases I’m not overcoming, rather than trying to come across as objective and giving them no insight in whence my errors stem.

I tend not to think anybody’s objective to begin with, but find that focusing on insight helps at least potentially illuminate something other than just myself.

Also, you don’t acknowledge your own cynicism all that often, you know? Most of the time you seem to be trying to come off as the voice of reality itself.

That’s a pretty cynical take on things. :slight_smile:

And I own up to my biases all the time. I’ve repeatedly said that I’m a cynic, a jerk, one of the most arrogant people around… That doesn’t require every post be prefaced with


or anything. Were I to do that, you (and others) would likely accuse me of trying to use it as an excuse to be completely unhinged, I’m sure. Though that might be, y’know… a little cynical of me. :stuck_out_tongue:

Aye, all too true. Doubly-Doomed to watch the stupid beat against the same castle walls only to have hot oil poured on their head like those before them.

The tint of cynicism jades the lenses of the wise.

Acknowledgement of bias cleans a foggy lens.

Eventually the lens will fog again.

Congratulations on another anniversary of posting on this iteration of the IGS.

How do you think the previous year went ? Better or worse than average ?

Hard to say. At this point it’s rare to see anything new on the IGS, and that’s exacerbated by capsuleer culture has developed towards healthy paranoia and not revealing your cards any more than is necessary.

The years blur. ■■■■ if I remember if a particular discussion was this year, or three years ago.

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I mean, the post you’re replying to is from YC 102, so… :smirk:

“A force for good in the Syndicate region” is an oxymoron.
I have become convinced since my last visit there that the capsuleer residents are the most uncouth sort. They had the temerity to attack my very expensive cruiser - and I wasn’t even trying to hunt them at the time. The entire region should have its outbound gates shut down and be left to rot.

If everyone thought that way about any system with its local ruffians and wandering rogues, we wouldn’t get anywhere. Capsuleers are of a very bored sort looking for anything to do. And if they can get away with it, they’ll try just about anything at least once.

Of course I’m one to talk. I’m almost married to a woman who’s natural height is 8’3". And I only recently found out because she’s tried to restrain herself to be less intimidating.

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Syndicate is null-security space, pilot. For our purposes, it’s a lawless wilderness full of enemies (who can at least temporarily become friends depending on circumstances). The practical rules of such a place are unkind, but also nearly inevitable.

The shorthand is NBSI-- “Not Blue, Shoot It.”

For the most part, any unknown contact is-- has to be-- presumed hostile because it often in fact is. To protect our own assets we can’t afford to worry about yours.

A very few nullsec entities may still practice NRDS-- “Not Red, Don’t Shoot,” famously including CVA. I am not sure whether that policy remains in place, and in my experience this makes their space more dangerous rather than less, but if you want a place to wander freely without being hunted by its local capsuleers Providence might still be open. (I’d ask, though.)

(No guarantees about non-locals even if NRDS is active; there’s a history of other groups using that space as a hunting ground.)

Other, more paranoid groups might also let you travel safely at their own discretion. But your odds might go up a lot if you call ahead to at least your destination’s local inhabitants and request safe passage (thinking here of I-RED). Even then, you may find that some groups are more honorable (and/or organized) than others.


It sounds to me like they were, in fact, civilized and responsible nullsec residents. As you yourself indicate: they live there. You do not. You were an unknown quantity entering their home, and they took steps to ensure they and their neighbors were safe.

You were the ‘barbarian invader’ in that scenario. Aria gives a brief explanation, but I just want to highlight something… because as she rightly points out, the behavior you seem to be seeking—the behavior CONCORD etc all tolerate and enforce in high-sec—is NRDS.

Now, to expand on Aria’s point, this is exactly why NRDS space is more dangerous than NBSI space. NBSI allows the local populations to maintain some level of security: Anyone not white-listed (blue-listed, I suppose) is treated as hostile. This, in turn, minimizes how effective actual small-scale hostile action can be.

NRDS means the local authorities… can’t take action against anyone until they have proven themselves to be a threat. This usually involves several repeat offenses, as people claim things were accidental, or they didn’t understand, or any number of nonsense excuses. And because the entire reason groups adopt NRDS is to be welcoming, those excuses are usually given the benefit of the doubt the first two or three times.

This is also why most experienced null pilots feel less safe in highsec than they do in enemy nullsec: in NBSI space, you know who the friendlies are. So you know who the hostiles are: everybody else.

In NRDS space (including highsec) you don’t. You know who some of the hostiles are. You might even know who some of the friendlies are. But nobody is stopping the hostiles from putting together a crew you don’t recognize and coming and blowing you up just for the giggles. And so that happens, a lot, every day in highsec. That’s all ganking is, after all: NRDS in action. (NRDS inaction, too.)

CONCORD retaliation is not prevention… especially when CONCORD, unlike even the most corrupt NRDS admins in nullsec, never permanently blacklists… redlists?.. repeat offenders. At most, you go and get a friend to buy you some pirate tags in jita, turn them in to CONCORD, and they forgive your offenses so you can go back to ganking.

So congratulations. You’ve been complaining about civilized people looking out for their neighbors. Don’t want to get blown up? Find out who actually runs those constellations, and open up a dialog with their government officials about travel permits… or, in capsulese… talk to their diplos about blue standings.


The Federation tried that a long time ago.

It became evident that it was the Federal government at the time that was rotten, not those who would become the Syndicate.

Mostly agreeing with Arrendis. One thing, though?

I think when I was in Providence CVA was running a tighter ship than that, possibly as a result of painful experience. One violation was I believe enough.

Even then, though, local procedure for bringing a newcomer aboard among unfriendlies within jump range seemed to be, “have new pilot remain in neutral and/or baseline-run corporation for present, train for covops and cyno, equip with force recon ship or covops STRAC, and have new ‘neutral’ pilot spearhead next black ops battleship fleet into Providence.”

Case in point.

There’s something a little ironic about feeling helpless as an ambushed gazelle while piloting (for at least the next ten seconds) a Nightmare-class battleship.

(More helpless. A gazelle might be able to break free and run.)

Pilot, as someone else with a damaged infomorph, I might a little bit understand your situation. Capsuleer training is easier than it once was, but it’s still not a trivial thing. Your infomorph is something that can’t easily be repaired or replaced. If it is in danger you should consider leaving backups of yourself, to be reverted to if corruption becomes severe.

This is common practice among our kind, even most capsuleers of your Faith. Even if damage is not completely disabling, keep in mind quality of life. Even if continuity of experience is preserved, a clone no longer capable of communication might not be someone you will wish to continue to exist as.

You may wish to set a specific line beyond which the question is taken out of your (current) hands. If nothing else, ability to communicate seems like an obvious one. A cloning that results in inability to communicate will make it difficult to live or even to meaningfully pursue your purpose.