Reading this thread while taking a dump.
Just fyi.
Source ?
Yeah, none so far.
Just posting to disagree with the title, itās not even needed to read the post.
This solo vertical EVE needs to go. L4ās are solo, POS should not be.
https://www.adam4eve.eu/stats_structures.php
Here are stats for the citadels. If anyone wants, he can see them amounts. Still high sec have the most of structures.
Also the amount of structures was getting lower before the cores. The abandoned status was working.
Amount of ātargetsā that was unanchored before anyone could destroy them in high sec is staggering.
Great success of content removal.
Content?
Iād call it content when people fight for the structures, and with quantum cores we have increased chances of that happening.
Hundreds of structures that nobody has time to destroy isnāt what I call ācontentā.
Now THAT was content! Iāve spent a week shooting down and looting structures in an incredibly well organised corp fleet with all types of roles; bashers, looters, haulers, defenders and suicide gankers, ship sitters and whatnot. I never killed that many structures per day as then and made quite a lot of ISK on a couple alpha characters. That it was incredibly fun. 
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To be fair, those are only the public structures. Most Upwell structures outside of highsec are not public.
But the point is made, there are still plenty of highsec Upwell structures out there, a few in every system. That is much healthier than the dozens of abandoned ones just sitting there because it was too tedious and unrewarding to explode them. CCP has done well in the last year to get structures to a better place, and anecdotally it does seem to me that people are fighting over them (both attacking and defending) more.
Not everyone needs to own a structure. This idea that Joe Sixpack can to do everything solo is toxic to an MMO trying to simulate a life-like economy. People need to be able to have niches and to trade with one another for goods and services. Making space for a ālandlordā class who rent out stations is a goal completely in-line with the idea of Eve. Honestly, I think there still is more work needed to be done to create a viable market for selling station services, but we are way, way closer to that after of a year-and-a-half of @CCP_Rattati and his friends on the Ecosystem team making changes to structures.
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Do you really not realize that adding incentives for killing ships wouldnāt make players any more interested in killing those ships, because that interest is already at 100%, and canāt possibly be any higher?
Youāre making it sound like people are passing over ship kills today because the drop rate is only 50%, which they wouldnāt do if it was 100%. That is an absolutely asinine claim.
I think cores are a great idea. Stations should be a group ownership thing not a solo thing. Station defense is also quite fun. Lets go on this line of thinking that if you can afford a station AND fuel it. I think you have the means to buy a 1 time purchase reusable core. Too hard to ask from most people I guess?
That doesnt even make sense.
Youre ignoring the fact that the citadel itself can have defenses.
Youre ignoring the fact that you can, as the defender, bring in as many allies as you wish, whenever you wish, for no cost.
Youre ignoring the fact that the timer is whatever you set it as, and therefore you have full control of when you will fight.
What āCardsā are in the hands of attackers?
It used to be like this before citadels existed, and we managed, and we didnt see it as a problem back then.
Any āplayerā can purchase 1000s of dollars worth of plex and buy anything they want, whether it be a titan or a structure. Just because I can go out and buy a titan, doesnt mean its meant to be owned and operated by a single player.
This has never changed. EVE has always been about being able to defend your assets. When Citadels first came out, the catchphrase was āBuild your dreams, wreck theirsā.
The fact that CCP has now made a better incentive to wreck their dreams, has never changed the fact that this was always an integral part of the game.
Even before the cores, we used to have people come in here and complain about how Citadels were being wardecced and how they couldnt defend it. Those people were making the same arguments that you are, now.
I thought any citadels can fit the service modules like the reprocessing facitlities? In which case, we already have citadels that are āJack of all trades but masters of noneā. The Raitaru/athanors are the Masters of reprocessing etc, thats why people use them. And yet you want a citadel that does all of these things, at the same rate as the āmastersā of each role, for no apparent reason.
NPC stations already are varied and provide different services. The problem with giving them bonuses is that they were never designed to have bonuses, even back when Control Towers were a thing. The whole point of setting up your own control tower/station is that you get better bonuses from the NPC stations, but at larger risk of losing it.
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You forget that the structures that have cores will be those belonging to megacorps that can and will be defended. And those will not be attacked. Because you will be losing the battle as attacker. And there are people with such very āgood standingsā that they will make you not even consider attacking them.
It will be hundreds of structures that nobody will be willing to attack.
Something akin to highsec blue donut.
It was change that made everything harder for everyone. Maybe only excluding those fat cats.
What change will you then propose?
Well, no, the other kids always had bats, and they replaced a single peice of sand with a pebble. The Core is only an initial cost, and its not an upkeep.
The problem you keep glossing over and never really want to address, is that the requirement for people to be able to defend their citadel has always existed and has always been a risk. The fact that CCP increased the incentive to do so, is only an argument that supports the fact that you have a bigger target on your back. Thats it. None of the other arguments are valid.
This was essentially what they did with the introduction of the excavator drones, though. Each drone was 1 billion isk, gaurunteed drop if they are deployed and the rorq is destroyed, etc etc.
None, no changes. Amount of structures seems to be good now. No more abandoned structures littering space and no more spammed structures ābecause planting them is easier than getting rid of themā. The abandoned citadel update and quantum core update did their work well.
The only extra structure update Iād like to see is the addition of a smaller structure to replace POSes that can allow solo players or small nomadic groups to have a place to live out from temporarily.
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This sort of thing can occur irrespective of whether quantum cores exist or not. It is trivial for larger groups to go around wardeccing and destroying every citadel and putting their own up. Omega and Friends Medialabs did this with POCOs a while back. But even they only stuck around the major hubs, because they understand that it isnt worth it to go around every single system in hisec and owning every single POCO.
The same is true with Citadels. For large groups, 800 million isnt a lot of ISK. Its not worth taking something down, getting 800 million isk, then spending another 1.1 billion isk putting up a citadel, in a remote region where you only see 5, 6 people in local at any one day.
And yet, in the remote regions, there are plenty of individual corps that ive never heard of, owning tons and tons of citadels. Nobody is in any rush to destroy them. The only people who think 800 million is enough isk to want to destroy them, are smaller groups, that can be fended off.
You missed the point, I wrote about the situation when nobody will attack anything. Its what I mean by removal of content, by creation of highsec blue donut. It will be BORING.
No, I completely got your point already and I donāt agree.
No changes.
I could afford anything but a Keepstar on my own and thatās just out of my own pocketā¦ Well, no I could do a KS but Iād be flat broke after. In fact I could drop multiple of anything but a KS, including cores. And Iām still on the low end of wallet sizes.
Keepstars, Sotiyos and Tataras shouldnāt be affordable for solo players or small groups, so they arenāt affordable for most individuals or small groups.
Just because YOU canāt afford it doesnāt mean others canāt. They are meant to be team structures that require a team to build and maintain. Butā¦
I suppose you can all just do lvl 4 missions instead of bashing structures now.
Maybe it is more entertaining for you.
Iām not sure what youāre aiming at.
Structure bashes without stakes are boring. Quantum cores added stakes to a structure fight, so defenders have a reason to defend the station when they drop one (rather than having the enemy deal with multiple timers and then drop another 10 structures to make them waste even more time). And attackers also have a reason to attack the station, because, well, loot.
Without quantum cores, people coud buy 10 of the cheapest structure, plant them everywhere and ādefendā their structures with time. It just takes a whole lot of time to destroy them all.
Now, unless defenders increase the stakes with a core, placing an uncored station is just as easily destroyed as it is anchored, decreasing the amount of endless structure bashes just to get rid of them.
Bashing a lot of structures = boring.
Bashing a few structures with stakes = fun.
Get it?
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You mean you will bash your own then?
Autobashing for content, that may be something like a new trendā¦
Sorry, I edited while you wrote that response.
Also it doesnāt make sense? Why should I bash my own structures? I donāt get any value out of that, rather, Iād lose value.