Second time being blown up by much better ships

New Citizens Q&A
41

keeping the trend of ignoring the actual arguments that prove it is bad.

but i said it already if you enjoy that fine but stop acting as if it is all fine and sweet and that the new players are just stupid and it is their fault for the game sucking and being toxic towards new players.

the facts are it sucks hard for new players and is not fair and you have to grind for ridiculous hours to get beyond that point.

and the gameplay is still ass all over.

i mean you can also just go outside and do irl by that point if you are so happy about losing stuff and real consequences. Start investing money or open a business.

42

ah so more grinding or should I say buy it with real money?

43

I haven’t seen a factual argument to prove it’s bad. I’ve seen your opinions which I disagree with. Which is fine. We are allowed to disagree.

Where have I said anything if the sort. Scroll up and see the posts where I specifically call out your corp for not providing you with adequate support.

Your opinion. Not a fact. You are however entitled to that opinion. Like I said earlier…… your opinions are fairly entrenched now. Nobody is going to change your mind as it’s made up.

What a ridiculous thing to say. The whole point of taking risk in a video game is escapist thrill seeking that doesn’t have irl implications. Just consequences in game.

Look i have responded in this thread helpfully and in good faith. The fact that your replies are starting to get hostile tells me that the purpose of your post was purely to “have an argument”. So please enjoy the remainder of your interactions from here on out.

If you really feel this strongly about how bad the game is the simple solution is to stop playing, stop posting, walk away and find something you do enjoy. :slight_smile:

Best of luck in your quest

3 Likes
44

it is the other way around. it is a fact that a new player is at a disadvantage compared to a vet or do you want to tell me it is the opposite?

gotta love the “it is just your opinion” thrown out without understanding it

45

Oh man. That’s not what you said. You specifically said

I mean I even quoted it in my response above

It doesn’t suck hard for new players. Many new players have a great experience in game. Hell I was a new player not that long ago. I loved it and got blown up plenty.

And you don’t need to grind ridiculous hours. You can have fun doing things you enjoy in game. And if you don’t enjoy the game then don’t play. It’s really that simple.

You obviously are not having fun. So don’t play. And quit fishing for an argument

2 Likes
46

You are correct, the system is bad. The crew you’re hearing from in this thread are the types that like to blow smoke and pretend that ganking new players is actually good for them and teaches them about the game and encourages them to stay longer.

Yes, you can focus learning on a few specific areas, and perhaps be somewhat effective in a lower-end ship within a few months, and go try to do some PvP or something. These people will try to sell you on the fact that “you can be in a cheap ship with level 4 skills and T2 weapons in a few months, and be competitive”.

They ignore the fact that while you’re in that ship, the vet will be in an assault or faction ship with more skills, better weapons, more expensive ammo, more experience at fighting, more ships to swap into, more ISK so they can afford more losses, etc.

In EVE, new players are competing with vets in every arena as soon as they enter the game. In the market, in mining, in PvP, in exploration, everything. And the vets like it that way and want to keep it that way. There’s no sugarcoating this, it’s bad game design, it drives away virtually all potential new players, and they can’t really admit it because making that the common public reply will just result in even fewer new players.

That said, new players can and have started EVE every day of it’s existence, and it’s always been an uphill battle against the odds. You don’t survive that battle by taking expensive, easy targets into low sec to earn a little more ISK than in high.

You get over the initial “everyone is better than me at everything” barriers by playing smart and choosing your approach carefully. You read up on the traps and decide what you’re going to use as your learning experience. You expect that you’re going to lose your ships often, and you learn the game in cheap ships that more than pay for themselves with the results of what you do.

Missioning, mining and exploration are all more profitable (when done carefully) than what you’re going to lose. WH diving, faction warfare, the same. As others have said, if you can’t make it over those barriers on your own, then find a group or corp to work with.

And lastly, if you look at all those challenges and say “nope, it’s not for me”, don’t worry about it. It just means you agree with something like 96% of all new players who try EVE and give up on it.

3 Likes
47

CCP even has numbers to prove that is true.

48

Well, see, actually they don’t. What they have is one presentation from 2015, that doesn’t give numbers or percentages for retention, but does base their conclusion on a very small number of cases (less than 1% of 80,000) while using language like “slightly more” and “slightly less” likely. With no real information on how the data was sorted, filtered etc. And going very far against the belief of the audience of veteran players.

Not something that any statistician would consider a valid conclusion to draw, I’d guess. If your data isn’t published, and if your data conflicts strongly with the opinion of several thousand active participants in the game, it might be wise to check your data again.

49

Well, it warms the cock to see how many better vets have been trying give advice and guidance to a frustrated newbro.

__I believe the expression is, “warms the cockles of your heart.”

Yeah, that too.

50

I used to fly an endurance in lowsec and mine (lots of) ice. A friend of mine also did the same thing. We wouldn’t be able to fend off an attack, either, but the point was to get in, get our haul, and get out before anyone came to bother us, then count our riches back at the base.

A barge is not going to be a match for two combat ships in all but a few very specific circumstances, regardless of how much you spent on it or how many sp you have. You just can’t win that encounter unless you have an ace (read: friends) up your sleeve.

The result of going to lowsec and mining in a lone industrial ship that was not prepared to immediately withdraw at the first sign of trouble is a predictable one, again, regardless of the ship’s cost or the number of skill points of the pilot. I suppose you could have been piloting a Rorqual and those two crusiers wouldn’t have been an issue, but in that case they’d radio for someone to hotdrop you and then you’d just be out a more expensive ship because you were unprepared. Again, regardless of how expensive your Rorq’s fit was, or how many SP you had.

Cost and Skill Points can give you an edge, but they are rarely the deciding factor in a fight. Know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em.

6 Likes
51

So Shipwreck offers you sage advice, where I would have just offered snark, but now its plain to see you’re just trolling.

It isn’t toxic. You simply suck at MMOs. Your troll is obvious troll.

EVE has been out for like 18 years? There is a bajllion articles out there.

Learn to EVE kthx :smiley:

Man the trolling is obvious. Hide it a bit better. First clue? Saying D2 is good ROFL.

Ahh so you also suck at D2 and trials. Got it. It just sounds like you are a bad player period. I’m betting you couldn’t win at trials with the broken pulse meta huh? ROFL.

False, false and false. Learn to EVE :smiley:

Nah dawg you meant bigger ship and got caught out. Learn to EVE :smiley:

Oh? Define PvP ship please :smiley:

I mean you can be a noob and its fine. But you’re just bad at the game :smiley:

Watch d-scan nub :smiley:

People go after ships they don’t think they can get all the time and win :smiley:

I don’t know what is sadder, the OP’s obvious troll attempts or the fact that you defending obvious troll ROFL.

Its clear from their posts, they aren’t a true nub. They just baiting. And not the good kind of baiting either, which involves neut vexors in belts with friends in a safe yennoe?

1 Like
52

perhaps im not a true noob because i basically played every MMO out there?

53

damn just what i said.

now I gotta be honest a similar thing happens for most games.

Forums and reddit are echo chambers for the vets that can not even see the flaws let alone acknowledge them.

Elitism and gatekeeping running rampant.

But there often is a small percentage of people who understand it.

The game is flawed and that’s a fact. If you can look over the problems because you like the other elements good for you.

But I ■■■■■■■ despise these other people trying to frame it as the player’s fault. aka elitism and gatekeeping.

I often like the analogy of fetishes. If you like feet, go ahead enjoy with someone else that likes it but don’t claim it is the best thing and everybody should love it. And if you don’t like you obviously did something wrong and it is your fault for not liking it.

In the end, there is still the subject of the gameplay itself being boring and bad which nobody even wanted to defend so far.

54

fire arguments, dictionary elitism.

"your argument bad because you bad "

55

Huh. So that makes it worse then. You’re just a bad player :smiley:

This right here is what keeps tipping off that you can’t go in the sun mate. No one is saying EVE is perfect, rather just you bad at the game son.

Learn to EVE :smiley:

I mean, its true? You went solo proc mining in low, congrats on having guts but maybe watch local next time? I dropped in on a solo proc 30km out from warp in and he warped out faster than Jebus cause he was actually paying attention.

I mean kudos for the trolling but it just makes you look bad :smiley:

Learn to EVE kthx.

1 Like
56

Yes, yes it is…perhaps not in the ways you think…but yes it is. Is any game not flawed? You have played many MMOs, yes? Were there any that players did not gripe about?

90% or more of problems I have had in EvE were my - the player - fault. It’s the same for everybody, sorry. In the same way you (correctly in some cases) point out that some refuse to acknowledge potential faults in a game, you yourself are doing the same thing just on the other side of the coin by seeing only faults (many of which are actually things you can do things about/work with).

Your fetish analogy makes sense.

I think you could be an asset to the EvE world if you got rid of your negative attitude (we have enough around here, ya know?) and be open to learning things.

EvE is a bit different of a game than many are accustomed to, I think. The game itself isn’t really the game. The game is merely a framework you build your own game on. The gameplay itself in EvE isn’t all that spectacular, frankly, but that’s not what keeps people in EvE and coming back to EvE.

I hope that you stick around in EvE and make your game…but if not that’s ok…not every game is of interest to every person of course. GLHF whatever you do.

1 Like
57

It’s true that EVE gameplay has issues with being slow, somewhat boring, somewhat clumsy in some areas. It definitely isn’t as flashy and smooth as more modern games. However not every game has to have quick 6-button combat and Hollywood animation.

EVE has many issues, but a lot of those are also wrapped up in a players expectations. If you expect a smooth playing, well balanced, somewhat fair, reasonably paced MMORPG, then you’re going to be disappointed with EVE.

EVE is more along the lines of, if you want to overcome many barriers and some real challenges in order to succeed when the odds are stacked against you, and you don’t mind learning a lot of details and complexities to do so. It’s got some interesting, long-term wrinkles that can take years to get a grip on.

Compare that to many modern games where you can max level in 30 days and then stand around going “Uh, okay, what next?” Answer: wait 3 months for the next expansion or raid. Finish it in 2 weeks. Repeat.

It’s kind of like the difference between people who want to play Super Mario Galaxy and people who want to play chess or Go. People who enjoy one style of game play might not like the other, but they’re both satisfying in their own way.

3 Likes
58

I disagree, living in lowsec faction warfare zone during my first 6 months I learned more about the game and the politics than I ever would have if i had not lived in lowsec. At that time i probably couldn’t have soloed out there in a procurer and lived, however, my corpmates loved when i was out in a procurer because they would wait just to counter gank the gankers. the other day i was out in a gila doing a level 4 esclation in lowsec when I was killed by a hecate flown by a veteran pvp player. I died not because my ship couldent have beaten the guy but because I dropped the wrong drones. Lowsec is hard i give you that but there is no better way to learn how to not get killed in the game.

9 Likes
59

You have learned to EVE.

OP, please take note.

2 Likes
60

There is a basic lesson every player has to learn: Losing a ship and cargo is part of the game. It’s not the end of the world. Even losing stations worth billions of ISK is normal. The guys destroying your beloved belongings don’t hate you, usually they just don’t know you and don’t care - they just take a chance YOU offer.

I really like prospering situations, so everyone can grow. But If you just want to play a space economy simulator, EVE Online is the wrong game. Here, you have to find ways to outwit your competitors.

By the way, collaboration brings much more income. Become friend with fellow miners, share boosts and intelligence. It is definitely not true everyone in EVE is your enemy - most love a little help, and even more just don’t care if you are not offering a quick kill.

2 Likes