Note:
I forgot to mention that this is confirmed by my previous post:
Being podded as a capsuleer is merely an inconvenience… Xuxe Xu: “lets kill millions of people with suffocation instead.”
2 Likes
I have one last question:
Are you afraid of death?
You conveniently didn’t quote that in your last reply.
Is that why you became a capsuleer? To escape judgement? Or merely to avoid facing your own conscience?
I pity any soul that displays that level of cowardice.
2 Likes
You referred to capsuleers as demigods. Now, what are human lives to demigods but dust? You cannot blame a demigod for immorality, as their sense of morality is different from those of humans, more warped as you could say, such as the morality of CONCORD, who do not defend, but avenge, and the continuous persecution of Kaikka Peunato, which lead him to his dark path. We feel no regret to this.
And no such demigods have bonds to these mortals (OOC no one gives a ■■■■ about what happens to millions of people in the Keepstar, they just blow it up), just like no humans bond to pigs or ants.
And it is comparable, as humans slaughter deer for the sport of it in grassy fields, us capsuleers hunt mortals for the fun of it in the wildness of space. As humans kill and slaughter pigs for food, a Capsuleer may slaughter slaves at her will, for the simple fun of torture.
And lastly, perhaps you’re just an animal rights group.
(OOC this does feel immoral, but I’m saying this not as a human, but as the human behind the imaginary Capsuleer)
Well. Yeah. I must concede that the use of the term demigod may have been a tad heedless. I’ll give you that. What I intended to say with the use of the term, is the capsuleers is as close to being gods as one can be, without actually being one. We don’t have the ability to defy the laws of physics, as an example.
However.
The point I was making, wasn’t so much about what humans would be to gods or demigods. It was more to illustrate the discrepancy between a mortal like Komi and an immortal like Xuxe Xu.
I also did mention about the common ignorance of capsuleers when it comes to mortal lives, such as with the destruction of stations and the like. And I also mentioned my view on that.
Anyways…
CONCORD is an interesting thing to bring up… Because… How do you punish an Immortal being? Take his freedom away? What good will that do, when the person is Immortal? Any conceivable time, would still be a blink of an eye to an immortal being.
Kill the capsuleer? Well, that is merely an inconvenience.
So. CONCORD punishes the only way it seems practical. By destruction of property. The only real mortality for a capsuleer is its economy.
So… Yea… Human life is being lost at the hands of CONCORD. Sure. But how else would you punish a criminal like a capsuleer?
On protecting… Well… How exactly would you do that in practice? Most crimes where CONCORD gets involved, is happening within seconds.
To return back to how capsuleers view mortals.
All capsuleers started out as mortal humans… All of them. And just to abandon all the the different views the empires have about justice and the value of life, just to act like a scrupulous deity, doesn’t seem to be an automatic consequence.
By all means, I myself have done cruel things. I have taken the lives of many mortals, either directly, or by inability to defend the infrastructure I have run in the past.
There was a time where I thought much less about the consequences of my actions. Sure. I am flawed. I know this.
But I have grown wiser through the years. The premature loss of life that I have been responsible for, weighs heavy on my conscience. I know, though, that in the end, it is impossible to avoid all premature loss of mortal life by capsuleer actions. New Eden is a dangerous place.
But I am on the side of the mortal humans, and I do everything in my power to limit unnecessary loss of life.
Regarding the analogy about hunting and livestock farming. I think that comparison is flawed.
Mortals need sustenance.
Yes… especially livestock, mostly exist to die from human hands, but they serve a very practical purpose of keeping the population alive. And just to remind you: most meat on the market is grown “artificially”. The remaining livestock farms, exist mostly where technology isn’t there to support a meat lab, and for those high-roller mortals that believe that “real meat” tastes better… That is however, another discussion entirely…
Regarding the people that hunt, well… I am sure by far the majority of those that practice hunting, is also eating their kill afterwards. I know, that in my culture, we also thank the killed prey for giving us it’s life. It is never without purpose.
And humans have done that since they first emerged in the old world on earth.
And if you really want to go metaphysical-philosophy into this, well… Most ecosystem has prey and predators. It just is a balance of life, that is hard to avoid in any ecosystem. And in some weird way, it ends up with a balance.
But you almost never see purposeless killing in nature. And definitely not killing because someone/something else did or did not do something. That is a thing only us humans do… Apparently.
As a capsuleer, then yes. I am more than a mortal human. But I was once a mortal human. But my immortality is no reason for me to belittle the significance or value of a human life. It is still just as valuable as before I became a capsuleer. It is just that I have become so much more powerful. But with power comes responsibility. And a human life is still worth a human life.
If fact, you could argue that human life is worth more than a capsuleers life. The capsuleer is practically immortal, so you can kill him a thousand times over, and he will still persist his existence.
You can only kill a mortal being once. What is more valuable?
If there existed a limit on capsuleer conscience transfers, lets say 1000, it would take 1000 capsuleer deaths to equal one mortals death.
But since Capsuleers are practically infinitely reborn, a human life is infinitely more valuable than a capsuleer life.
But I think i’m starting to go to the infinite clouds of existential philosophy
Soooo… If Xuxe Xu is so terrible (and from what I’ve read she is), why isn’t there a hunt for her?
1 Like
Good question.
Simple answer: Immortality.
Complex answer:
Firstly, you need to want to waste time and resources on hunting an immortal.
Secondly, you need to want to waste time and resources on someone that will never learn.
Thirdly, it requires that you don’t have anything better to do.
But you are right. There ought to be.
There is. Has been for a very long time. It’s called EvE.
In any case - doesn’t matter…@Colinde_s @Kristov_Bellechek you peasants don’t have the guts to put a bounty on me and probably couldn’t afford a billion+ bounty anyway.
1 Like
At least he’s willing to change his mind when encountering evidence that his existing beliefs are wrong.
8 Likes
@Kristov_Bellechek @Colinde_s we should organize a hunt against @Xuxe_Xu for failing to use purple (or even red) beams instead of green, and only three beams instead of eight. Very disappointing for a Dark Lady of the Sith 
I expected… darker…
(I have the greatest respect for Lucas. He’s absolutely brilliant, I agree with almost all his ideas, and he’s a forums MVP for sure. There’s no "but"s or "however"s to that statement. I regret that he does not accept this to having been executed as an operahouse performance from the start, intentionally grandiose and melodramatic, for added entertainment value. I will not attempt to convince him otherwise.)
I thought to myself “Maybe Komi has communication issues?” - she kept digging herself a deeper hole whenever she answered the questions we asked questions on her thread, so I thought maybe an interview + collaboratively polished summary would give he a fair second-chance opportunity to provide substantive answers to the questions we’ve raised time and time again, and to disqualify the hunt criteria. (The poor communication is why the interview itself wasn’t published, only the summary.)
This was the best player driven content I’ve seen in I don’t know how long! 
Anticlimactic as it was, I thought this thd brought up good questions and at least gave some attention to the game and the CSM.
Harassment. How far is to far? Will this repeat itself for every CSM election now? With the lack of any interaction from CCP or the ISD here, I have to agree this is how CCP see’s this situation.
RP. How does a CSM candidate who wants to run in “character” communicate ooc or should there even be a need for it?
I actually did read Komi’s thd and thought not a bad angle at first. Then the hater’s chimed in, the hard questions started etc. and I didn’t pay any more attn till this thd started. Then I had to go back and reread everything and thought about the ooc part.
That’s when I decided to jump onboard. I was hoping for a bigger pig pile, but meh. Komi knew from the start that this was probably not going to go well on a RP platform. I saw a great chance to get some PR for the game at Komi’s expense (Sry, you were the who fell on your sword, not me lol) which backfired! I had no idea how CCP might react as far as harassment, but if these guys were going to put themselves in the line of fire for something like this, so was I. So I chipped in. I have the isk, it’s a good PR stunt, so why not? Considering that usually no more than 200 players are on the forums, (source, the ISD) I thought it had a pretty good turnout. Toward the end, I did start to feel bad for the guy, but fortunately it worked in his favor. I didn’t think for a minute that my laughing at the situation and offering a way out would have any affect and get brushed aside. Turns out the evil forum readers aren’t so bad after all! Go figure…
I want to thank Archer and Komi for being such good sports in all of this. This was a lot of fun for me!
As for for the CSM, were stuck with them so we might as well get as much as we can from them.
1 Like
As usual, you are fair and level-headed, and your assumption is not unreasonable. Obviously my opinion has been that there are a great many concerns about this CSM candidate, but those concerns alone were not why the thread was started. That WOULD be stupid.
Komi declared herself to be mortal, and hunting-to-permadeath an aspiring high-profile RPer is quite appetizing for any reason, or none whatsoever. This served as grounds to start the bounty which, in addition to being totally EVE in spirit, drew attention to Komi’s lack of qualifications and more importantly the need to take CSM seriously and balance RP/OOC on CSM. The need for increased RP/Lore advocacy in CSM also came up in ensuring discussion. It would not be difficult to compile a “Best of The Hunt” quotes collection of non-Komi points raised.
I’m going to create a new thread on just this topic in the near future. I’ll link it here when completed.
1 Like
Big assumption that those Matar didnt have it coming, thats all Ive to say
4 Likes
Yes we can, we add mass to our ships using an afterburner.
We have reps.
Make him not immortal. CONCORD acknowledges that capsuleers are demigods and accepts the moralities that come with it.
There are prey, and predators. The prey are the mortals, and the hunters are the capsuleers. There’s always a balance, just like triglavians hunt on capsuleers, we are hunted as well. We are even hunted by other capsuleers! This all ends in a balance/
Yes it is. You are immortal, all humans are mortal, therefore, you are not human. Human morality does not apply to you and if you bother to learn the morality of mere mortals go ahead, but for us, death means nothing and hate, anger, and screams mean nothing, because we simply has seen too much of to bother.
Yes, indeed, but then, a tiger’s life its more valuable than a human’s for the same reason, but no one thinks so when they murder tigers for humans’ sakes. How valuable a life is never matters, because it all just depends on who you are. And never forget, you are one of us, and killing mortals for the fun of it is your privilege.
Because it’s less interesting. Killing someone who is applying for CSM and promises to be mortal (and doesn’t shoot back) is one thing, just killing another player just like you and me is another. It’s the morality of capsuleers: we kill for the fun, if it’s difficult and not fun and dangerous then “NOPE”.
I admit, I liked “Knight in Rusty Armour” more than I care to admit.
Improvements for next time: Keep it all RP/IC!
Komi knows that while the bounty may be done with and void, the trophy of a noteworthy mortal’s corpse is still a fine enough prize for some to continue the hunt by their own means… Be careful out there Kombear!
5 Likes
It made me dizzy trying to keep the 2 apart! 
I can only speak for myself, but I’m pretty sure all of the Hunters would not go back on their word in this matter. 
Unfortunately, I fear it may be too late. I waited 2 yrs to catch a friend who had run away from a battle all the while telling us on TS that he was on his way. We were both on TS as well when I finally caught him. 
Some people might never give up if they feel they have reason enough… Fly safe Komi!
1 Like
What an anti-climax
1 Like
E=mc^2
Fill all of space with remote repair beacons?
You forget that CONCORD is controlled by the empires, and no empire want to risk their capsuleers being lost. And the capsuleer based (player) empires would revolt if CONCORD, decided to tamper with already established laws and agreements, on capsuleers in such a manner. And if any of the old empires decided to not comply with CONCORDs changes, they would have a massive advantage.
I concur, that capsuleers are elite posthuman, but we where still born as human.
Yeah, but mortal humans aren’t an existential threat. On the contrary, they are a massive engine for economics. Especially for newer capsuleers. But also for veterans. Sansha always needs a beating. So does most of the “pirate factions”. Sure, you can align in what ever direction you want. Applies to the Triglavians as well.
But the point is, mortals are useful to us. Despite them being almost “invisible” to most capsuleers.
I concur, again, that we are a post-human “race”. But we still have lived the mortal life. And immortality does not necessarily equal that the morals and ethics of our origins become meaningless. For some, sure, but not all.
Well… no? Tigers and humans are equally mortal. They both only have one life to live.
And no. I cant ever forget I’m a capsuleer. I’m immortal. But that still doesn’t mean, I see that my statue means, I have the privilege to disregard mortal life as worthless. I can choose to take that position, but I don’t.
Maybe, it’s because I still remember the mortal days of my life. I still remember the sacrifices I had to make, to become a capsuleer.
And I know, my experience of reality is just as real and complex as any human being.
Our brains, our thoughts, our senses, are still human in nature. Flawed and fragile as they may be.
Remember, our immortality grows from our mortal past.
By all means, you can decide to ignore that our immortality has its roots in mortality. Makes no difference to me. I just see it as being an ignorant position to take. But Meh. For each his own.
I actually think that this thread shows that, for the most part, controversial topics can be discussed passionately without too much intervention from the forum moderators. Of course, the community tacked back and forth in regards to civility, as well as staying on target, but I thought that in the whole, the issue was an example of self moderation by the majority of the participants. It greatly helped that the original poster kept a level head and steered the discussion when it seemed to veer off course.
Now if we can stop the few crew members frequently running up to the helm of a thread and yanking the wheel violently to the port or starboard, which seems to quickly escalate into a tug of war which usually runs the issue aground, then perhaps more robust discussions will be given free rein by the authorities. Hard, but fair and simple questions from the most critical posters seem to actually help any thread keep on course, while any one or two sentence insults seems to trigger at least a half dozen escalating snarky communications.
…and it wouldn’t hurt CCP to have their official community relations team to post one or two simple statements early in any thread that appears to be passionately discussed to clarify where the company stands with an issue AND then let the discussion flow freely afterwards. More direct communication from CCP helps reduce the need for moderation by the ISDs…for the most part.
5 Likes